Scattered post-election thoughts

I

Pilfered shamelessly from our friends at Rorate Caeli:

Although he again lost Protestant voters to his GOP opponent, Obama held onto his advantages among Catholic and Jewish voters. He won 70 percent of the Jewish vote, down from 78 percent in 2008, and he won Catholic voters 50 percent to 47 percent. Romney carried Protestant voters by a 13-point margin, 56 percent to 43 percent. (Source: Politico)

The shepherd hamstrings his own sheep, and the wolves devour them more easily.

II

There are a lot of reasons Romney lost, but my favorite is this: he is the kind of man concerning whom it’s impossible to tell if this article was intended as sarcasm.

III

It’s not much of a silver lining, but…

After three or more decades of relentless judicial warfare, cultural propagandizing, and often outright violence, “gay” “marriage” only barely eked out a narrow victory in a quasi-landslide year in one of the most liberal states in the Union. Some remark about human nature seems apropos.

IV

The following passage from Scripture popped up in the psalmody for Lauds this morning, and it seemed too relevant not to share. There’s something to be said for “lifeboats, not soapboxes.”

Hear, you that are far off, what I have done, and you that are near know my strength. The sinners in Sion are afraid, trembling hath seized upon the hypocrites. Which of you can dwell with devouring fire? which of you shall dwell with everlasting burnings? He that walketh in justices, and speaketh truth, that casteth away avarice by oppression, and shaketh his hands from all bribes, that stoppeth his ears lest he hear blood, and shutteth his eyes that he may see no evil. He shall dwell on high, the fortifications of rocks shall be his highness: bread is given him, his waters are sure.

Isaiah 33:13-16.

V

Actually, this passage also popped up in Lauds, and it, too, seems timely:

Naked came I out of my mother’s womb, and naked shall I return thither: the Lord gave, and the Lord hath taken away: as it hath pleased the Lord so is it done: blessed be the name of the Lord.

… if we have received good things at the hand of God, why should we not receive evil?

Job 1:21 & 2:10.

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89 thoughts on “Scattered post-election thoughts

      • There are multiple solutions. One is to make America something it was not. Perhaps you are a monarchist? Another solution is to change America back to what it was. Although America as it was founded is not my ideal government, it is the best government we’ve got, the one I’ve been born into, and it is the one I’ve sworn to defend. Until it is finished, I feel I should work to restore limited government, liberty, and prosperity. I’m a classical liberal by birth and duty, but something else at heart.

      • Earl,

        From 1607 in Jamestown to 1776 America was actually ruled by a monarchy. At the Constitution Convention of 1787 Hamilton gave one of the first speeches explicitly stating we needed to model the US president on a monarchal model. Monarchy has never left but it has been greatly profaned. The whig-oligarchy that eventually triumphed in the aftermath of the revolution had all the bad elements of British system we supposedly revolted against- but practically none of the good elements. Even your hero Rothbard argues that the Constitution marked a radical centralization and that many modern day problems viz via “limited government” may be traced back to its implementation.

        If you believe that America was simply created ex nihilo in 1776 then you truly are a radical liberal and your endeavor is doomed to failure because as Don Colacho said there is nothing more detestable then yesterday’s progressive.

      • You probably wouldn’t be glad to hear that I believe America was created in the legacy of Oliver Cromwell. My liberty is in Christ, if that is radical enough for you.

  1. There are more stabs in the back that we have back. Jews, Catholics, blacks, Protestants. Who isn’t stabbing us in the back?

  2. I grew up Catholic but stopped at like 12, then converted this year.

    I choose Catholicism because it seemed like the most traditional. All the protestant denominations were extremely liberal.

    Their pro-immigration stance (i.e. desperate attempt to get new hispanic members) does make me second guess though. They actually told me in mass to support a pro-immigration ballot initiative.

    • While many Protestant denominations are liberal, those that are explicitly Reformed tend not to be. One Reformed denomination, the Orthodox Presbyterian Church, was founded by J. Gresham Machen, who fought against the liberal coup within the Presbyterian church. He wrote, among other books, Christianity & Liberalism, about which he said the following:

      In my little book, Christianity and Liberalism, 1923, I tried to show that the issue in the Church of the present day is not between two varieties of the same religion, but, at bottom, between two essentially different types of thought and life. There is much interlocking of the branches, but the two tendencies, Modernism and supernaturalism, or (otherwise designated) non-doctrinal religion and historic Christianity, spring from different roots. In particular, I tried to show that Christianity is not a “life,” as distinguished from a doctrine, and not a life that has doctrine as its changing symbolic expression, but that–exactly the other way around–it is a life founded on a doctrine.

      As Prof. Roebuck has pointed out (here and elsewhere), Reformed Protestant denominations with catechisms are pretty reliably traditionalist, and reject liberalism (for the most part, anyway).

  3. While Obama won all Catholics 50-48%, he lost White Catholics 40-59%. Some people cried about the youth being such a large collective of traitors. While this is true on social issues, which is very disappointing, it was not true overall since Whites between ages 18-29 voted 51-44% for Romney. However, it is saddening to see that voters who believe abortion should be legal made up 59% while those who believe it should be illegal made up only 36%. Add to that the support for state (not federal) legalization of gay marriage was at 49% compared to those opposing it at 46%. And 65% believe illegals should be given a path to citizenship compared to 28% who want them deported.

    America is in serious trouble. I knew this was coming but it is one thing to know something is coming and another thing when it actually has come.

    Also, check out the tolerance of the Left in Maine.

    http://occidentaltraditionalist.wordpress.com/2012/11/07/some-interesting-exit-poll-data/

  4. A landslide victory for Obama after he ran a campaign centered on stamping out orthodox Christian morality; this is the worst possible outcome. Like Latin America, anti-clericalism will now be our official ideology, and politicians will compete with each other over who can promise to persecute Catholics the most savagely. Predictions for the next four years:

    1) The next Republican nominee for president will have social views like David Cameron’s.
    2) The media will catch a Republican congressman saying something to the effect that homosexuality is a sin, causing an enormous scandal. After this, Republicans will purge all gender complementarians from the party.
    3) The bishops will cave on the HHS mandate.
    4) The bishops will silently abandon the pro-life movement and concentrate their political efforts on “immigration reform”.
    5) Gay marriage will never lose another referendum.
    6) The United States will launch a military assault on Vatican City before Obama leaves office. (I originally predicted ten years. See here: http://bonald.wordpress.com/2010/08/14/the-future-of-the-catholic-church/) The Holy Father will decline to let his Swiss Guards fight to the death. After a suitable show trial, he will be thrown in an American prison. If we’re lucky, the government of Malta will file a protest.
    7) The United States will double down on its efforts to smash the more traditional cultures of Eastern Europe. After a couple years of grumbling about “cultural imperialism”, all these nations will surrender and be homosexualized.

    • 8) All the fake Christians will melt away into the brush like butter. If there are any of us left (God have mercy!) we’ll look around and remember how crowded it was at the Orthosphere back in 2012.

    • Frankly a dose of anti-clericalism might just be what we need to finally purge the hierarchy of modernism, just like Julian the Apostate persecuted the Arians.

      The United States will double down on its efforts to smash the more traditional cultures of Eastern Europe. After a couple years of grumbling about “cultural imperialism”, all these nations will surrender and be homosexualized

      Yep countries like Poland that were “liberated” by Pope John Paul the Clown are now Americanist beachheads into Eastern Europe. Maybe Putin will let us form a traditionalist legion in the Russian Army and thats where some of us will meet our end.

      • Frankly a dose of anti-clericalism might just be what we need to finally purge the hierarchy of modernism, just like Julian the Apostate persecuted the Arians.

        This argument has absolutely no logic. Liberal christians (considering as such only those that actually go to a Church) are not the main force behind liberalism nowadays, although those bastards did indeed start it. The major pro-liberalism ranks now are outright atheist, or buddist, hinduist, exoteric, etc, or just claim to be Christian but haven’t been to a church in the last decade. Liberalism no longer needs Christians as it already has a large enough critical mass to go on alone.

        Yep countries like Poland that were “liberated” by Pope John Paul the Clown are now Americanist beachheads into Eastern Europe.

        I think that you are being overtly pessimist. The fall of communism was a good thing, even considering that I agree that the radical leftist-liberalism of western europe is even worse then communism. At least communists didn’t plan to replace their populations with aliens, but that another ideology is even worse, does not make communists good. And I think that many countries like Poland will eventually wake up when the first big country gets completely destroyed by liberalism and islam. It will probably be France or England in my oppinion.

        Maybe Putin will let us form a traditionalist legion in the Russian Army and thats where some of us will meet our end.

        The nasty thing is that Russia is also in a bad shape for the long run. It has a demographic crisis and a growing islamic problem… but they still have for them that they are not liberal, so they can defend themselves. But yes, Russia is a candidate for a laste refuge of traditionalists …. if it manages to survive.

    • Along Bonald’s lines, I cannot help but feel America really has turned a corner with this election, which I suppose shows what an ignorant dupe I’ve been, hoping against hope. Until now it seems like it was at least minimally plausible that America would elect an aggressive liberal of Obama’s caliber only out of desperation and ignorance (as it did in 2008). Until now it was maybe reasonable to suppose that America was like a nervous bride, stalling at the reception to avoid consummating her marriage to liberalism; or, more appropriately, like a teenaged girl in high school debating whether or not to fornicate with her boyfriend on prom night. But no longer. Prom night has passed and America has submitted to sluttiness.

      I shudder to think of the years ahead. Especially thinking of the men who will lead us through the coming persecutions. Cardinal Dolan, arms outstretched, wearing a giant foam cheese wedge as a hat. Cardinal Donald “Look how wonderful we are!” Wuerl. Any of the smug, boring, interchangeable, milquetoast deacons that abound in this country. Treachery, incompetence, and fecklessness everywhere. Pygmy shepherds for a starved and shrinking flock. Surrounded by the ruins of a church increasingly alien and receding lamely into history. The whole world in its ending; if only my heart were stone.

      • There are three things we can count on: taxes, death, and the mainstream conservative movement letting us down.

        You can take it to the bank, and use it to pay your taxes until you die.

    • “6) The United States will launch a military assault on Vatican City before Obama leaves office.”

      I believe you are letting your pessimism and despair getting the best of your judgment.

      On your other points, though, you might not be far off. We are headed for certain disaster.

      • The legal process for “suing the pope” is already in motion and has overcome every hurdle it has yet encountered. Everyone seems to think the idea of the pope actually being led away in chains is crazy, but nobody can ever point to anything that might stop it. The Left is always doing unprecedented things. The Right goes straight from not resisting because they see no need (“Crazy things like that just don’t happen.”) to not resisting because the battle is already lost and resistance is hopeless. Why shouldn’t arresting the pope follow the same trajectory as gay marriage?

      • I agree with you, Bonald. Everything that has happened so far has seemed very crazy… at the time. And now we take it for granted and mourn the loss, and then move on to denying the next crazy thing being thrown at us.

    • Interestingly enough, there is a little story about Pope St. Pius X (orate pro nobis):

      In 1909, during an audience for the general chapter of the Franciscan Order, Pope Pius X suddenly fell into a trance. The audience waited in reverent silence. When he awoke, the Pope cried out:

      “What I see is terrifying! Will it be myself? Will it be my successor? What is certain is that the Pope will quit Rome, and in leaving the Vatican he will have to walk over the dead bodies of his priests.

      “Do not tell anyone this while I am alive.”

      Just prior to his death (August 20, 1914), Pope Pius X had another vision:

      “I have seen one of my successors, of the same name, who was fleeing over the bodies of his brethren. He will take refuge in some hiding place; but after a brief respite he will die a cruel death.

      “Respect for God has disappeared from human hearts. They wish to efface even God’s memory. This perversity is nothing less than the beginning of the last days of the world.”

      Pope St. Pius X was born Giuseppe Melchiorre Sarto. Pope Benedict XVI was born Joseph Ratzinger.

      Giuseppe is Italian for Joseph.

      Of course, I can’t verify it (or haven’t been trying hard enough), so take it with a pinch of salt. But still, quite chilling.

  5. Since he doesn’t need to trim his policies or to curb his lefty-liberal inclinations with the next presidential election in mind, can we assume Obama will move further to the left during the next four years? As the Scots used to say, in for a penny, in for a pound. Obama has nothing to lose now when he gambles with America’s future.

  6. I don’t think proper for us to be criticizing ++Dolan like that; especially if you are Catholic. It serves no purpose and does not show the respect that he deserves due to his office. Do it at home, not in the internet for everyone to see.
    Regarding immigration, I now support the bishops view. If this election showed me something, is that the United States is no longer a nation, and there is no turning back. We are legion. We might as well accept reality: we are an empire, rather than in a nation. The old American nation needs to find alliances with other nations within the U.S. territory, so at least we can get an imperial government that strives for the their own good. I think that Hispanics are the way to go.
    Many of the Mexican illegal immigrants are not very educated, but still have basic values that are more in agreement with traditionalism than with any other. Some are still open to traditional Catholicism. I know many who are descendants of Cristeros. Cubans and Venezuelans despise leftism, although many are still tainted by secularism.

      • Argentina is an absolute economic basket case and has sunken into total moral depravity. I modeled our own decline upon it

        I already was in Argentina, and the place is not as bad as you make it sound. As everywhere else in the west there are loud marxists/feminists/greens/etc, but I personally I think that it is still far from a hell-hole like the Netherlands where people openly look forward to the death of their country. At least Argentina is not importing enemies to kill them, so I would say that they are less depravated then France, England, Belgium, Holland, etc.

        On the economic aspect, however, I do have to agree. The populist Kirchner is the most incompetent government in terms of economy in the entire west IMO. It looks like they read the worse ideas from the 80’s and felt that anyone who didn’t experience the 80’s at first hand should receive a second chance at seeing stupid economic ideas like prohibiting exports to decrease internal prices, which leads to lack of products in stores, masked hyper-inflation, prohibition from imports (except from China), prohibition of transactions in forein currency, and even a micro-management of how many foreign currency habitants can have! I read some time ago that if you buy currency for a trip on your way back you have to give back what was in excess… oh no.

      • I already was in Argentina, and the place is not as bad as you make it sound.

        Where I live in the US, and where I’m from in Germany, everything looks pretty good, too. If anything, the spots with the worst moral decay look the most pleasant because they are siphoning off the wealth from the rest of the area. Munich is so nice in comparison to the dying villages of the Bavarian forest, downtown DC is a tourist paradise and the farmland of Alabama is a wreck, etc.

    • Hispanics have double the illegitimacy rate as whites and roughly comparable rates of abortion. Second-generation Hispanics seem to have all the pathologies of native whites with virtually none of their virtues. And Latin America abounds with liberation theology and liturgical abuse where it isn’t utterly apostasizing to Pentecostalism. So even if we accept the claim that it’s OK to destroy our cultural heritage in the name of whatever, it’s far from clear that Hispanics are on “our side.”

      • Granted, but whites are the liberal elite, and are committing cultural suicide. The cultural heritage is being destroyed anyway, and this election showed this to be irreversible. What to do? The remnant has to get allies somewhere, or be destined to oppression and extinction. While liberation theology heresy comes from Latin America, at least they have some basic Catholicism. Don Colacho was not exactly European.

      • Here in the US, Hispanics are at least exposed to traditionalist ideas. They don’t have that luck in Latin America, where leftist rule is absolute.

      • They are exposed to them? Where? How? If they are, they consistently reject them unanimously, both at the polls and in the organization of their personal lives.

        “What to do,” indeed. Maybe there is nothing to do except get ourselves through the coming storm. And maybe the only way to do that is to minimize our degree of exposure to our enemies.

      • I think that evangelization is the only answer, and believe that Hispanics are ripe to being re-evangelized. That being said, it is a desperate ploy, and am not sure it can succeed. I just don’t want to go out without a fight.

      • Hispanics are our enemies. Not because we say so, but because they do. They are unabashedly tribal, as can be seen not just from their insular behavior, but also from the existence of groups like MEChA and La Raza. Their low IQ as a group means that they can never participate on an equal footing with us, in any field. The political mess in every country south of our border demonstrates that they are incapable of forming or maintaining governments that suit Western preferences and norms. Note also that 71% of the Hispanic vote went to the socialist candidate.

        This is not to deny their humanity, nor to say they are not worth evangelizing. It is to say that we cannot make them our civilizational allies, and that we cannot hope for anything positive from our association with them.

      • But Bill, Argentina and Uruguay are whiter than America ever was. The race argument does not hold true there. They annihilated their native populations. They are entirely European countries in South American soil. However, they have the same problems. Colombia, which is far more mixed, have seem to have its house in order far better, in spite of the drug lords and the guerrillas.

      • Latinos voted against gay marriage in California. They’re also pretty faithful about church attendance–Spanish-language Masses are always packed, even as English or Polish parishes are dwindling. If Latinos actually received good catechesis at those church services they’re so eager to attend, then maybe they’d be more solid traditionalists.

      • Hispanics are our enemies. Not because we say so, but because they do. They are unabashedly tribal, as can be seen not just from their insular behavior, but also from the existence of groups like MEChA and La Raza.

        The whole idea of “Hispanic” is stupid, and it was invented by the USA left at what seams to be an attempt to prevent latin american whites from grouping with USA whites, which would be the natural thing to happen.

        I am brazilian and 100% white. I don’t live in the USA, but it strikes to me as utherly ridiculous that if I did, then I would suddenly be “hispanic”, something with which no-one in Brazil identifies himself to, and I would be in your words “your enemy”, which is even more ridiculous considering that I am a reactionary and simpatize with fascism.

        MEChA is clearly a mestizo/indian group, and it looks very wierd to me. Looks like a mexican thing. In Brazil mixed-race people usually recognize that they are part white and that they therefore must oppose black and indian nationalism.

        The political mess in every country south of our border demonstrates that they are incapable of forming or maintaining governments that suit Western preferences and norms. Note also that 71% of the Hispanic vote went to the socialist candidate.

        It was not always a mess. Brazil was doing great between 1964 and 1980 under military rule, until we were blessed with the wonderful american Democracy.

        But yes, unfortunately latin americans got completely conquered by marxism since the redemocratization. But so did western and northern Europe…

        Colombia, which is far more mixed, have seem to have its house in order far better, in spite of the drug lords and the guerrillas.

        I think that the guerrillas are actually a positive influence, since the marxists are busy in the jungle and everyone can clearly see them as the devils that they are.

      • Note also that 71% of the Hispanic vote went to the socialist candidate.

        Most Europeans do the same, but I don’t see you blaming that on their IQ.

      • A good point, Alte.

        I do tend to think that the massive immigration may be raising the amount of alienation in this country. Auster made the excellent point that if an immigrant does not assimilate he remains a traditional man of his own society who barely speaks English and spends most of his time with his own people (and gives us little harm or benefit), while If he assimilates he or his children often become part of our left leaning crime ridden under class.

        Japan has it’s problems, but there is less explicitly anti traditional politics in that country. It also has no immigration of note.

      • Ralph, could you expand on the problems in Uruguay and Argentina? I’ve never been to either, but Uruguay in particular looks from its history and from various statistics to be a pretty functional place. Argentina’s history is more colorful, but it also looks to me, from a distance, like a pretty functional place. People who have traveled to these places seem to have favorable opinions of them as well. When people make lists of successful Latin American countries, Uruguay, Argentina, Chile, and Costa Rica are usually high up on these lists.

        Or are you just talking about secularism, which seems to be a widespread disease outside of the Ummah.

      • The whole idea of “Hispanic” is stupid, and it was invented by the USA left at what seams to be an attempt to prevent latin american whites from grouping with USA whites, which would be the natural thing to happen.

        That’s pretty much right. The Census was annoyed in the early 70s because the new, often mestizo, immigrants from Latin America self-identified as white on forms instead of as Indian. This made them hard to count separately from whites. There was a (failed) effort to count them in the 1970 census. The current system was put into place in 1977 and used in Censuses starting in 1980.

        There was an interesting survey done by Pew showing that most Hispanics don’t want to be called Hispanic or Latino. Most commonly, they prefer their actual country of origin/ancestry or just American. Which is kind of funny, since “American” usually means Scots-Irish when it is used (that is, written in after checking “other”) on Census forms. Lots of people of “American” race in Appalachia.

        Another funny thing about Hispanic is that there are immigrants from Southern Mexico, Guatemala, etc who don’t even speak Spanish (instead one of the Mayan languages) and who often have little or no European ancestry who get classified as Hispanic white.

      • Alte,

        I noodled around, and it looks like Argentina had a big crime spike around 2001, just as your post says. But, its homicide rate is now back down to below that of the US. Its human development index (basically life expectancy, income, and education level) is really high for S America. So, I guess things got a lot worse there in 2001, but it still looks to be a better place to live than most other S American countries. No?

      • If you want a clear picture of the situation in Argentina right now, read the comment thread to that article. The crime statistics, the health statistics, the inflation statistics… all of it is a complete fabrication.

      • Here’s what I know: In the 50’s, Latin America was the preferred choice for Italians, Portuguese, and Spaniards for emigration: Catholic populations, romance languages, economic growth, and appreciation of their European heritage. Latin America was then what Southeast Asia and Korea is today in terms of growth and standards of living: crime was non-existent, yet the racial mix is not different than today’s.

        The Cuban revolution changed all that. It gave a base for Marxist ideas to expand, it provided an example that could be romanticized and distorted. Poor Latin Americans had an example of a socialist paradise. White liberal elites bought that nonsense. Few people understand, outside of Latin America, how pivotal that event was. It is analogous to the American revolution vis-a-vis the Ancien Regime. The Mexican Revolution, while destructive, didn’t go outside Mexico; the Cuban Revolution was a Latin American disaster.

        I was born in Venezuela in the 70’s, and enjoyed the last years of that state of things. Now, I would be too kind to my country of birth by saying that it is a basketcase: it’s a subsidiary of Hell.

        Argentina had the same income per capita as the US in 1900. To say that things are OK is simply inadequate. Argentina could have been a major world power: now, they are a joke living of past glories, and 2 soccer World Cups.

        Still, it doesn’t change the fact that the US has now a heterogenous racially mixed population that came from Latin America and won’t go back. Deportation is impossible, and they have a higher birth rate than natives. They are western in culture (even if illiterate), nominally Christian, and not Mahometan. Can we make a significant portion of them our allies?

      • I’ve long been fascinated by Argentina (obviously), so I’ve been paying attention to what’s going on over there out of personal interest. Just saw this, which gives a good summary from the American Thinker:

        How to Destroy a Rich Country

        Very disheartening, but it does show how a country can get caught in a cycle of dysfunction. Inflation, of course, increases immorality by fostering a short-term outlook in the populace.

      • Granted, but whites are the liberal elite, and are committing cultural suicide.

        There are two types of whites: Brahmins (elite, liberal, fashionable) and Vaishyas (erm… the opposite). Brahmins preach cultural suicide; Vaishyas preach the opposite. But Brahmins don’t practice what they preach; neither do the Vaishyas.

        I say all that to say that there is a vast unwashed mass of white working class Americans, who happen to be rare in midtown Manhattan, prepared to do what they’re told. What they’ll do depends on who’s doing the telling.

        Don Colacho was not exactly European.

        Umm… this guy was NOT European? Define European!

      • I do tend to think that the massive immigration may be raising the amount of alienation in this country.

        Yes, I think this is an important point. The RCC likes to straddle both sides of this issue by berating America to welcome immigrants per its tradition, but insisting the immigrants fully assimilate. The problem is that they arrive in such large numbers, and at such a fast pace, that they have little interest in assimilating.

        Or, at least, they used to arrive. I think we have a minor exodus going on right now. The Hispanic birthrate is still above replacement-level, but it is also steadily falling.

        All that said, ending like Japan is a nightmare scenario. It is downright frightening to see an entire country give up and wait to die like that.

      • I have long had a problem with the “Hispanic” label, not least because it is a linguistic label, rather than an ethnic one. However, it’s what we have to work with.

        In America, the context in which I was speaking, Hispanic is nearly the same as Mestizo, and it’s the Mexicans that we have the greatest problems with. In America, Hispanics born in America are twice as likely to use welfare as native-born whites, not least because they are far more likely to be poor. The much-vaunted Hispanic “family values” are a myth, as Hispanics have a 53% out-of-wedlock birthrate—twice that for whites—and a majority now support same-sex pseudo-“marriage.”

        Hispanics don’t vote for Democrats because of low IQ; they vote for Democrats because Democrats support the socialist redistribution of wealth, just as Hispanics do. Their low IQ means that they, like blacks, will be a permanent underclass. Their low IQ means that they will not support symphonies, museums, or even libraries, and will not make significant contributions to the advancement of our civilization.

        I wish them no ill. I just wish they would stay in their countries, rather than come to mine and help destroy it.

    • Was Cardinal Dolan respecting his own office when he wore a cheese head at Holy Mass? When he laughed it up and broke bread with Moroni and the Kenyan butcher? Most especially when he flogs the heresy of “religious liberty”? Nope he’s a leader in the mold of Pope John Paul the Clown.
      Another nation-crusher for Christ
      Ah ha it seems as though the Bishops are just playing the same game the WASPs played on us 50 yrs ago when they bussed in black sharecroppers from the South into urban Catholic neighborhoods.

      • OK, you are Archbishop of New York. How do you know you would have done any better? As I see it, our bishops need our prayers, not open criticism from their flock. They have a lot of that from the NYT anyway.

      • I think that the cardinal has quite a lot on his plate right now. It’s easy to criticize what he’s doing without considering the difficulty of his position.

      • Hey, Ralph. Watch the YouTube video, Church of St. Francis Xavier (New York, NY)-Mass of Rededication. In this video, the good archbishop/cardinal absolutely panders to the Rainbow Flag crowd, and he has the manner of a successful Cadillac salesman making a speech to the local Lion’s Club. As a human being he is a failure. He sucks. Christians are going to have to quit being so charitable to those who are supposed to be guarding the flock. Please don’t waste anymore of your own time defending a doofus like Cardinal Dolan.

        My favorite Martin Luther quote: “The theologian of the cross has the courage to call a thing what it is.” And Cardinal Dolan is not a good shepherd. He is a chicken-hearted politician. It doesn’t matter if Prinz Eugen or Finn McCool were Cardinal Archbishop of New York and did not do a better job than Dolan is doing. There are objective standards by which Christian leaders are judged, and Dolan is a failure.

      • One of the things I like about this blog is that there are people more hardcore than I am here.

        I’m largely with Alte and Ralph on this one, though. It is very hard to tell from where I am sitting, at least, what is going on with the Catholic hierarchy. When one of them intimates that they are worried about real, active persecution of the Church and Catholics in the foreseeable future, I kind of believe them.

        It’s easy to say “Let justice be done, though the heavens may fall!” when we aren’t responsible for tending the flock which is, like, currently standing under the teetering heavens. Maybe I would be courageous if a gun was pointed at my head. I doubt I would be courageous if it were to be pointed at the heads of a bunch of people whose welfare I was responsible for—or even whether recklessly pissing off the guy with the gun would even really constitute being courageous in this case.

    • I don’t think this is workable. Hispanics have low average IQ and first generation Hispanics lack rudimentary cultural literacy. We can’t dog-whistle to them. If we want them to figure out that the D party and the hideous elite it represents is their enemy, we have to tell them that. But not in the words I just used, in words that are likely to work. Words which now get you ostracized and fired and which will soon get you imprisoned. Are we going to do that? I think not.

      • We may have low IQ, but I posit that average IQ is too low anyway for most groups. It is the leaders we want. Maybe high IQ may is an evolutionary disadvantage.
        Germans were to Romans what Hispanics are to Americans. We need to educate our Ostrogoths, or suffer them as Huns.

      • Inapt analogy, Ralph. All Northern Europeans share the high IQ mutation, but a similar mutation is absent among the American Indians (regardless of which part of the Americas they are from). German barbarians, once Christianized, became civilized. Building on the ruins of antiquity, they built the greatest civilization this world has yet seen. In contrast, at the time of European discovery, Native Americans were, by and large, Stone Age savages without even the wheel. The Mayans and the Aztecs made some achievements, sure, but none of those come close to our patrimony, and they show no sign of contributing to it now.

        Again, this is not to deny the humanity of our Hispanic brethren. But we need to wake up to the fact that they are really and truly different, that they cannot participate in a Western country on an equal footing, and that gap will always cause problems. The solution is that which God demonstrated for us with the Tower of Babel: each people in their own lands, free to choose their own futures. Good fences make good neighbors, and all that.

      • Can you explain this mutation for me? I’m always interested in a bit of genomics. Since the North American natives are the descendants of Asians, doesn’t this mean that East Asians are missing the same mutation?

        That explains everything.

      • Alte,

        I’m afraid I’m a little rusty on the details, but the theory is that both Europeans and East Asians developed a similar mutation, but independently; the mutation for the latter group occurred after the split with those who went on to populate the Americas. Ashkenazi Jews have the highest average IQs, but their mutations come at a sometimes terrible price: genetic diseases like Tay-Sachs.

        The European mutation has similar effects on all areas, while the East Asian mutation affects mathematical abilities more than verbal abilities. I believe the Ashkenazi mutation is similar to the European one in its overall effect.

        I’m sorry I don’t have sources, but the premiere work in this area is The Bell Curve. There are some other well regarded works whose names escape me at the moment, but a search through appropriate websites (Steve Sailer, View From the Right, and even Wikipedia) should lead in the right direction.

      • OK, Ralph. How are we going to get the “leaders?” And who are they, exactly? Right now, they way it works is that the elite look around for white leftists with at least one Spanish speaking ancestor, declare them “Hispanic leaders,” and present them to America as such. Examples are legion. Groups like Mecha and La Raza don’t appear to me to be manifestations of any underlying ethnic activism. Rather, they look like leftist networking mechanisms for selecting the kind of “leaders” I mention above.

        As far as I can tell, Hispanics don’t particularly follow these “leaders” or any identifiable leaders. Rather, they just vote their pocketbooks. I’m happy to be proven wrong, though—I’m definitely not an expert.

      • Alte and Bill Lewis:

        The particular genes which regulate intelligence and how they work are not known, or mostly not known. The evidence of genetic intelligence differences among races is less direct than that, though it seems to be enough to convince to all but the most closed-minded ideologues. Of course, the vast majority of contemporary Americans are closed-minded ideologues on this issue (or are terrified into pretending to be).

      • The particular genes which regulate intelligence and how they work are not known, or mostly not known.

        I know. LOL I wasn’t being completely serious, I’m afraid. I’m assuming that the “high IQ gene” is right next to the “pancreas gene” and the “opposable thumb” gene.

      • Where high IQ individuals are allowed to assortively mate and produce offspring at rates higher than lower IQ individuals, the average IQ of a population will rise. For that to work, however, there have to be 1) high bars to marriage; 2) pretty strict taboos on mating outside of marriage, and 3) a willingness on the part of the married to, ya know, reproduce. Maximizing freedom and egalitarianism is precisely the wrong way to do this. The only “gene” in Western Europeans (and for northeastern Asians for that matter) was a society and culture that for scores of generations encouraged the “smart” to make babies and “not smart” to not do so.

  7. Looking at this picture I get the impression President Obama is not so bad after all. How many Catholics were influenced to feel alright voting for him: I wonder?

  8. Um, what? As Lawrence Auster put it, “a failed, irresponsible, unworthy, lying, leftist, anti-American president” was re-elected. What part of this “is not so bad after all”?

  9. The almost universal fatalism in reaction to Obama’s victory (on conservative blogsites) tends to produce ‘calamity fatigue’. There probably has been a cultural and demographic shift during the last five years after which it seems unlikely that a dyed-in-the-wool WASP will ever again be elected as president. But the United States is still here, and no doubt the Republican party will address the new situation by selecting Marco Rubio as their candidate in 2016.

    • That may be true, but Mexican-Americans won’t vote for a guy because he is Cuban-American. Many, I would posit a majority, would vote against abortion or gay marriage if put in a referendum. However, when electing their representatives, they don’t want one who would potentially deport their relatives that have been living with them for over 10 years. That is a dilemma that no other ethnic group here in the US has.
      This election has shown to me that the time for deportation is past. America’s Social War was fought, and the Socii won. Citizenship will have to be extended, and the border closed. Otherwise, they will be voting for Obamas for decades.

  10. Alte, since I’m no longer on your site Traditional Christianity, I thought I would try to answer you question “If black people had higher IQs, would they be less criminal?” here (Actually, I would maybe rephrase it to say any American with a low IQ who is from a broken family and/or lives in a poor neighborhood). From reading the chapter on crime in The Bell Curve, the answer would seem to be yes, since as Murray and Hernstein suggest intelligence may not necessarily be synonimous with wisdom but it makes it a lot easier for people to actually be wise and avoid crime (They provide charts of course to support this). Of course as you suggested there were alsoa lot of less intelligent people in the past but there was less crime, but then the family structure (illegitimacy for blacks was only in the teens; for whites less) was much better, plus there was so much more stigma against certain behaviors, stronger communities, and less moral relativism – factors which apparently overrode low IQ. I think it’s important to mention this effect of culture, since if we could reinvigorate it for modern times then the problems that are associated with low IQ could be alleviated.

    • Hmm… I would say (and it sounds like you would agree with me) that higher IQ can lead to more moral behavior in an amoral society. There are natural consequences to personal immorality and future-oriented and clear-thinking people are more likely to see them and respond accordingly. At least eventually, once they see the self-destructive nature of their behavior.

      However, moral behavior will generally be more common in a morally-upright society even if a particular person is less intelligent and even if the mean IQ is lower. The quality of leadership matters a lot, as most people really do just follow along and emulate their “betters”. If the “betters” are better, then everyone is better. A rising moral tide lifts all boats.

      We now have the bizarre situation of the higher-IQ people not practicing the degeneracy that they preach. Morality for me, but not for thee. So you have married women coming out with songs like “All the Single Ladies”, describing how they party all night in the club and slut around, when they’re really at home crocheting doilies and baking muffins, while awaiting the birth of their legitimate child.

      • The issue is that the degeneracy they preach is an option that they want to have should their status quo be not satisfactory. Liberal elites may not be degenerate in their behavior on average, but they have the degeneracy and allow it because they can afford it without major consequences to their economic wellbeing: If I am very rich, I can pretty much do whatever I want.

        What these elites don’t understand is that the premium of that option is too high for their lessers to purchase. Why can’t the peasants divorce and have children out of wedlock if I could should I need to?

        Additionally, there are economic incentives against immoral behavior. If I am worth millions and get a divorce and remarry, the cost of my behavior is in the millions. If I am worth nothing, then… well.

        Thus, while they push immorality in the believe that they could incur in it, they don’t incur in it because it is too expensive. The masses, however, behave the way they do because the elites approve of their behavior, and because the consequences of their behavior won’t be apparent until they are destitute.

      • Yes, Bill, I agree.

        If I am worth millions and get a divorce and remarry, the cost of my behavior is in the millions. If I am worth nothing, then… well.

        The irony of that is that divorce is so much more devastating to the poor and working classes than to the rich. Chris Rock made that point about a prenup once. Funny and vulgar, but very, very true.

  11. @Steve Nicoloso – “Where high IQ individuals are allowed to assortively mate and produce offspring at rates higher than lower IQ individuals, the average IQ of a population will rise. ”

    I don’t think this has ever actually happened in history with the ?exception of US Mormons for the relatively short period of time they have been using contraception.

    Throughout the rest of the world and human history, I am pretty sure that fertility was above replacement for all classes but that differentials in reproductive success were due to differential *death* rates, especially child mortality.

    http://charltonteaching.blogspot.co.uk/2011/05/child-death-and-demographic-change-and.html

    The poor probably always had a lot of children, but almost all of them died before reaching adulthood; while a much higher proportion of the offspring of skilled people (the ‘middle classes’) survived to reproduce. The result was the increased IQ of Europe and East Asia.

    In a nutshell, the selective situation which raises IQ was restricted in geography and history; and that era began to end eight generations ago c1800 with the industrial revolution.

    Since then modernity has been living off the intellectual capital of the middle ages (especially the combination of high intelligence and creativity which emerged among Europeans). That capital is now likely to be depleted by the various demographic transitions,

    http://charltonteaching.blogspot.co.uk/2012/06/taking-on-board-that-victorians-were.html

    and we lack geniuses in sufficient numbers (and in the necessary fields) to get allow modernity to outrun the vast increase in population due to the low mortality of the poor which was driven by modernization caused by geniuses…

    So we are no longer able to sustain modernity, since we lack the necessary ability; and its decline is exacerbated by the socially parasitic consequences of an earlier phase of modernit.

    (The relatively few creative geniuses who are still around are seldom able to make the massive societal impact which they used to, being mostly excluded and powerless; and indeed – since potential geniuses are nowadays mostly post-religious nihilists, they seldom even try to make a *real* difference to ‘reality’ but instead seeks career and status: since they do not even *try* to do great work, they do not succeed.)

  12. Felipe, I think the Greeks are right with the Golden Dawn. There is no more time to fool around with “Hispanics”, the “Church”, etc. The Church has actively helped millions of mexicans stay in the country illegally so they can have more parishoners. Mexicans don’t care about the u.s. constitution, its a gringo document! They may be catholic but that is not enough, they don’t want to assimilate or learn the language, let alone know what a constitutional republic is. The problem with white liberals is that they thinks its all going to be okay if we are a country run by blacks and mexicans, gays and lesbians. It won’t be okay, it will be tyranny and the only way to fight back is with force of arms. Alex

  13. I don’t think this has ever actually happened in history

    Actually, it’s what’s happening now. Assortative mating is higher now than ever.

    I am pretty sure that fertility was above replacement for all classes but that differentials in reproductive success were due to differential *death* rates, especially child mortality.

    Yes, but more intelligent people had lower birth rates, too. Still above replacement level.

  14. I think I’m actually rather skeptical of the overall argument that “more intelligence = more morality”. The highly intelligent tend toward atheism and barrenness, and mass demographic suicide and apostasy seem to be the height of immorality. Trading a group of people with messy lives for a group that is dying alone with their cats doesn’t strike me as a very appealing answer.

    • The highly intelligent tend toward atheism and barrenness, and mass demographic suicide and apostasy seem to be the height of immorality.

      The highly educated tend that way; not quite so much the highly intelligent. See Audacious Epigone’s GSS work. The primary lesson, I think, is that we suffer from too much education (i.e., credentialing), not so much from too much intelligence.

      • Thanks for your thoughtful responses, Alte (and thanks to the Orthosphere for allowing me to use your forum to respond). Although I confess that I have a hard time believing, I am sympathetic to the qualifications you mentioned. For instance, the citizens of Scandinavia might be smarter than a lot of other peoples and in some sense have more stable societies as a result of this intelligence – nonetheless there is a sort of dreariness and amoralism (as you put it) to countries like Sweden or Norway that I think is bad for the soul, this in spite of all the material wealth that exists in that region.

  15. A question worth asking:

    If Mexicans would naturally be conservative voters if not for the GOP’s “opposition” to immigration, why is that Mexico itself (which is, yanno, full of Mexicans) has largely been ruled by mad anticlerical socialists for the better part of a century, virtually without interruption?

    • I am not sure if you are being entirely fair. Those forces have been in power largely because of their sheer brutality. Really the problem in Mexico is much deeper than just “socialism”. Free Masonry influenced and financed by America has always sought power and the destruction of the Church. Here in the United Snakes they could achieve this end relatively peacefully because after all we’re a product of Masonry. But in places like Mexico, Ireland, Ecuador and Italy (to name a few) required the full force and violence of the state.

      One Cristero was worth more than every “religious liberty!” Americanist on EWTN combined.

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